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Post by andy on Oct 28, 2023 4:36:45 GMT -5
Okay all,I've finally had an executive meeting with myself and decided on a winter top end refresh.
For a while I've not been happy with the oil consumption and although I get no smoking on start-up or running [according to my mate who rides behind me ] I'm honestly questioning myself whether I fitted the oil control ring correctly when I last did the job,I overlapped the crinkly oil ring which I later read somewhere that you should'nt do,just butt up end to end.
While I'm in there I'm going to do the grubscrew mod to tighten up the rocker shafts. Also the camchain and obviously a full inspection of every other moving part.
Expecting to make a start in the next few weeks and no doubt I'll be popping the odd question.
Watch this space !
Andy
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Post by gcrank1 on Oct 28, 2023 18:38:19 GMT -5
Just be sure to expect you will do more than you initially think.
Ime I seem to spend at least 50% than I thought I would; good sense tells me now to straightaway double my planned budget.
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Post by andy on Oct 29, 2023 4:43:14 GMT -5
Just be sure to expect you will do more than you initially think. Ime I seem to spend at least 50% than I thought I would; good sense tells me now to straightaway double my planned budget. Correct. Spent a lot of thinking time..do I sell it as is and buy another Japanese or brit classic ?experience told me I could buy someone elses bike that needs money chucking at it. Better the devil you know was my conclusion  . Not got a bottomless pot of funds but reckon I'm prepared...piston & rebore [or new rings],camchain,gasket set..reckon £300 - £400 should see it done,anymore I'll ask Santa  . |
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Post by redgalvin on Oct 29, 2023 7:28:50 GMT -5
Okay all,I've finally had an executive meeting with myself and decided on a winter top end refresh. For a while I've not been happy with the oil consumption and although I get no smoking on start-up or running [according to my mate who rides behind me ] I'm honestly questioning myself whether I fitted the oil control ring correctly when I last did the job,I overlapped the crinkly oil ring which I later read somewhere that you should'nt do,just butt up end to end. While I'm in there I'm going to do the grubscrew mod to tighten up the rocker shafts. Also the camchain and obviously a full inspection of every other moving part. Expecting to make a start in the next few weeks and no doubt I'll be popping the odd question. Watch this space ! Andy I did the grub screw mod at maybe 80,000 miles despite the fact that there was no detectable play in the shafts. |
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Post by stevep on Oct 31, 2023 16:45:18 GMT -5
Will you be posting a few pics of parts as they come off the bike? What's your current mileage Andy? One item id be keen to see is your camchain tensioner. See how much of a groove the chain has carved in it.
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Post by andy on Nov 1, 2023 10:34:10 GMT -5
Will you be posting a few pics of parts as they come off the bike? What's your current mileage Andy? One item id be keen to see is your camchain tensioner. See how much of a groove the chain has carved in it. Will attempt to load up pics Steve although I may need some help I have done around 12000 miles since the last topend refurb and yes the long tensioner had 'grooved a bit' and I put it on the linisher at work to tidy it up. I could reasonably argue that the refurb is not really neccessary,bike performs well,could start a bit better from cold,compression is good so a new set of rings may do but I'll accurately measure everything before we move forward.I'm concerned with the oil consumption and could be possibly losing it..further investigation.Still wet sumping and I'm gonna have another look at the oil pump seals. Deliberately waited for this time of the year to tear it down,do the odd hour on it as and when. Now heres a debatable point,my mate is trying to talk me into the new [next January?] Triumph 400 single that looks tasty and an even more tastier price, £4,999. Anyway,for now its the SR  |
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Post by stevep on Nov 1, 2023 12:32:49 GMT -5
I took a look at the new Triumph 400 after your mention of it in another thread but was disappointed they went for that generic look/shape almost devoid of any Triumph hallmarks. Keep coming back to the fact that the SR hits the spot for me in so many ways, I'll stick with it until my arthritis says otherwise.
Uploading pics is usually pretty simple, once suitable sized files have been saved on your device. Using 'add attachment' in top right corner of the post and navigating to your saved file location. Good luck with the stripdown!
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Post by andy on Nov 2, 2023 13:12:37 GMT -5
Okay guys so far so good and heres an update [hope I don't bore the nuts off you all with this project ]. Engine out,a serious de-grease/washdown.On the bench and on a purpose made stand from Kedo-31 euros delivered to the door ,its slightly cheap and cheerful but my oh my does it make things easier and not chasing the unit allover the bench when spannering ! So far rocker cover off and on inspection all very good but I will do the grubscrew job [as said earlier] on the rocker shafts- the exhaust shaft did have a minimal amount of slop.Camchain looks/feels fine and locates nicely on the sprocket-I'm not looking to replace items with hardly any wear. Weekend should see the head ,barrel and piston all dismantled ready for measuring and inspection and also the camchain guides Steve  . And finally-I'm in your hands here lads...quality gasket set ? Athena or any other reccomendations ? |
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Post by stevep on Nov 3, 2023 12:08:02 GMT -5
There were issues around thickness of some pattern head gaskets. Consensus on old forum was to go OEM or Athena. Others potentially suspect. (Can't recall if other pattern head gaskets were too thick or too thin.) Sounds like you're getting stuck in. I don't think it's possible to bore us with your rebuild Andy, it's pretty quiet around here. We could do with the entertainment!
Edit: Clutch cover gasket thickness is critical to performance of oil check valve and Athena or Yam were the recommended items there. In that instance the pattern parts were too thick .
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Post by andy on Nov 3, 2023 13:26:32 GMT -5
Thanks for that Steve re-gaskets. Now the plot thickens,I've just removed head,piston and barrel and noticed the piston has 'picked up in 4 places',sort of corner to corner,this is a wiseco piston and I've seen evidence of this before on the old forum....gotta say though I never felt a 'nip up' when out riding.Doing a few measurements I found the rebore to be correct to wiseco spec [0.1 mm or .004"] I'd previously taken the steps to replace the piston and made some enquiries think I'm gonna go down the OEM cast alloy route,which interestingly specifies .002" -.0025" clearance,obviously the wiseco ali is a different grade or the design tends to expand more.  |
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Post by redgalvin on Nov 4, 2023 8:47:43 GMT -5
Thanks for that Steve re-gaskets. Now the plot thickens,I've just removed head,piston and barrel and noticed the piston has 'picked up in 4 places',sort of corner to corner,this is a wiseco piston and I've seen evidence of this before on the old forum....gotta say though I never felt a 'nip up' when out riding.Doing a few measurements I found the rebore to be correct to wiseco spec [0.1 mm or .004"] I'd previously taken the steps to replace the piston and made some enquiries think I'm gonna go down the OEM cast alloy route,which interestingly specifies .002" -.0025" clearance,obviously the wiseco ali is a different grade or the design tends to expand more.View AttachmentView AttachmentWow, good thing you tore it down. |
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Post by andy on Nov 4, 2023 15:18:15 GMT -5
Believe it or not it was running very well . I'm gonna take a few measurements piston/bore and see where I'm at. I've very carefully cleaned the piston up and the bore looks perfect and was thinking of just getting the barrel glaze busted BUT i'll talk to the man for his opinion. I really don't mind forking out for a new piston and rebore but I'm thinking of the latter. Pics coming soon. |
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Post by gcrank1 on Nov 5, 2023 20:33:24 GMT -5
Did you check the positioning at tear down of the ring end gaps on the piston? When I tore down my '76 oil burning XT they where all in line to the front! And Wide! That in a factory built/never been apart engine (I knew and acquired it from the orig owner, it had used oil from new).
How are the ring end gaps dropped back in that bore?
Being me....Id dress those contact points on the piston (not smooth but to a 'grit' that will hold oil), lightly hone the bore and use a ringset that will have a min. end gap.
Again, on the XT, I used a 0.010 over ringset and end filed for gap, it ran Great. Btw, my piston skirt to wall clearance on the major /minor thrust axis' was almost to the wide side of the factory spec but considering how wide the Wiseco was spec'ed at I was not concerned.
Also, iirc, it was determined well after many of those Wiseco pistons had 'stuck' that the spec'ed clearance was too tight. Since yours doent look horrible and should clean up nice, and with a light hone in the jug, the clearance should be about right.
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Post by andy on Nov 6, 2023 3:41:42 GMT -5
Thanks Blake,all experienced opinions very welcome.Okay,can't comment on the position of the gaps and too late now ! but measuring the end gaps in position tell me theres significant wear.I'm with you on clearances,wiseco spec is on the tight side and I'll have an accurate [bore mic's,external mic's] picture in the next day or two and I'm pleased with the minimal effort required in cleaning the high spots off the piston. On stripping the valves out of the head I've found too much wear on the inlet stem and will replace it [slightly stepped at the head end of the valve,exhaust is fine and within spec. More later |
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Post by gotsron on Nov 8, 2023 16:16:27 GMT -5
Hi Andy, I was interested in how others view those scuffed spots on the piston. I was interested that they were closer to the piston pin than the center of the skirt, and looked pretty equal. So the idea that the clearance is too tight seems true to me. The fact that there are no problems with running and no obvious problem with the rings is a good sign.
Sounds like fun, and maybe I'll get one of those engine stands, that sounds pretty handy!
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